Iron Mountain gets the shaft ...

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Searn	Iron Mountain gets the shaft ...		Lead	[-]
All-Searn Hall of Fame Posts: 6170 11/10/08 11:43 AM Board Owner http://michiganhsfootball.com http://ndfanzone.com	Tags : None Wow, Iron Mountain as the home team has the longer trip in their game against Montague. How did they decide on Gaylord? My map has (city to city) Montague to Gaylord: 3 hours, 40 minutes Iron Mountain to Gaylord: 4 hours, 55 minutes Some home field advantage! As far as I'm concerned Montague should have to travel to Iron Mountain HS ... and the same for Iron Mountain if Montague had home field. "Crank Me Up!" Check out the New Forums Michigan High School Hockey Michigan High School Wrestling
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SenatorAtoms		#1	[url]	[-]
Freshmen Unranked Walkon Posts: 21 11/10/08 12:53 PM The Senator's Chamber	They prolly decided on Gaylord because Cheboygan was already taken. Don't worry, if Montague plays like they did against Clare they'll want the shorter bus ride home.
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eagleCHAMP05		#2	[url]	[-]
Senior Posts: 222 11/10/08 12:57 PM	Iron Mountain better be thanking the MHSAA for not making this a Yooper Dome game. Montague's spread in the perfect climate indoors and on that turf would be a tough thing for Iron Mountain to stop. Now that its outside, Montague might have to revert back to the T like they did against Clare in order to counter the bad weather. It's okay when you're respected, but when you're feared, that's when you've got the power.--Frank Lucas
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Mr NCAA		#3	[url]	[-]
All-Searn Hall of Fame Posts: 6185 11/10/08 1:11 PM MHSAA Football Stats	TCSF is suppose to be the home team and has to play in the YooperDome so that's an even bigger disadvantage for you Searn. I thought that perhaps 3 or 4 of these 5 games would end up in the YooperDome. I was really hoping for 4 to reduce costs some more and to provide a good weather facility. I guess that the MSHAA didn't want the players getting home that late, but the D8 could have been the last game of the evening since St. Ignace isn't that far away. With only 3 games in the YooperDome, the CMU should have been the next choice to play 2 games instead of Cheboygan and Gaylord.
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HSSportsGuru		#4	[url]	[-]
Senior Posts: 182 11/10/08 7:31 PM	This nothing new for U.P. teams. Last year, Menominee had to travel to Gaylord to play Standish-Sterling. Menominee was the home team, but had to travel almost twice as far to play that game. Lots of lower Peninsula teams squak when they get shipped to the Superior Dome this time of year. I somewhat understand if the L.P. team is unbeaten and/or has the better POP average. But I cannot understand ANY coach this time of year choosing to want to play outside, when they are given an option to play indoors at the Superior Dome. It seems that all the remarks I've read after an L.P. team plays a game at the S.Dome is that they LOVED playing there, regardless of whether they won their game or not. How can driving a few extra miles be such a big thing? I would think coaches from all over would love to play indoors if possible. I guess the only ones that don't want to play at a dome are those coaches who don't have any confidence in their own teams abilities against an upcoming opponent. IF that is their reasoning, then perhaps those coaches should get out of coaching then.
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DSMOOV12		#5	[url]	[-]
Freshmen Unranked Walkon Posts: 7 11/10/08 7:34 PM	Montague had their scare, off-game, whatever you'd like to call it. Kater and company will take care of I.M this weekend in my opinion.
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upfootball		#6	[url]	[-]
Senior Posts: 293 11/11/08 9:45 AM http://up-football.com	TCSF always CHOOSES to play in the Dome. They like it. They think it helps them if they get to Ford Field. Gotta love that attitude. I have no idea why Iron Mountain was forced to go all the way down to Gaylord. If this was Montague's decision this was a HUGE mistake. The weather they played in Clare is nothing. A little rain slows down your offense that much? Please.... Gaylord is in a lake effect snow/rain belt. Iron Mountain is now an overwhelming favorite in my opinion. If Montague goes to the full house T they will struggle to move the chains. IM sees that offense all the time. It isn't as difficult to stop as the Spread of turf! Still irritates me that the UP folks cannot see a triple header in the Dome on Saturday. Iron Mountain didn't get the shaft, us fans did. BTW - Iron Mountain would win in the Dome as well. Montague has speed. Ok so does Iron Mountain. I don't want to hear any Montague excuses after this loss. The best team will win.
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BIGREDS89		#7	[url]	[-]
All-Searn 2nd Team Posts: 1351 11/11/08 10:46 AM	Yep, I think Montague should OFFER to head up to the Dome like McDonald (Orchard View) did in 2004. I just think it would be better for their overall offense. http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k245/marinercoachkk/singlewing.gif
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Doc38		#8	[url]	[-]
Sophomore Posts: 48 11/11/08 10:56 AM	8 hours travel to play a football game? With today's economic struggles in the schools, this is probably a good move. Now, if the MHSAA was offering up money for the trip, or hotel rooms, it might be another story. But they don't until the finals. MCC got hosed like this a couple of years ago against Norway. MCC (yes, they got lucky and somone flew them, but not the fans), had more POP, but Norway got to be the home field and where their home jerseys. Plus, the MHSAA made them play on a Friday night for a Semi Final. The team that had to travel the farthest, had tp play on Friday night. Stupid!!!!!!!!!! Norway had to travel 40 minutes, and played in there the week before. When it comes to the MHSAA, Murphy's law does not apply. You have to do the George Castanza thing with them, do the opposite of what you are thinking, and you can guess them a little better. If you want fairness, generally you can't count on them.
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upfootball		#9	[url]	[-]
Senior Posts: 294 11/11/08 1:49 PM http://up-football.com	As far as I knew it was MCC's choice to go to the Dome that weekend. As far as Home jerseys..... In the Regional finals it doesn't go by playoff points. The Region 1 teams wears the home jerseys and the Region 2 teams wears the away jerseys. That is the way the MHSAA still has it setup. Playing on a Friday night was also MCC's decision. If the fans want to $%+!@ then take it up with the one's responsible. The MHSAA does not force any team to play on Friday night during the playoffs. If they cannot agree the game is on Saturday. Again that is right in the rules. 8 hours to play a football game is the norm in the playoffs for UP teams. Nobody is bitching about it. If the other team has more playoff points then they earned the right to play it closer to their place. Such is the case all the time. If I can use Kingsford for example. Traveled to Cheboygan 4.5 hours. Traveled to Remus Chippewa Hills 8 hours this year already. Both Chippewa Hills and Cheboygan had more playoff points. Nothing to $%+!@ about. You want to play in the playoffs you have to go by the rules. Those rules are fair in my opinion. You want a home game? Earn it. I agree on one thing though. You never know what the MHSAA is going to do. They makes some shocking decisions sometimes. Last year they scheduled the Marine City-Kingsford Semifinal in the Superior Dome and then changed it Monday afternoon to Gaylord. Both Kingsford and Marine City were scratching their heads on that one.
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Doc38		#10	[url]	[-]
Sophomore Posts: 50 11/11/08 2:51 PM	#1, it wasn't a regional final, it was a semi final game. #2, the reason MCC was forced to play Friday night was because there was 2 other Semi Final games that Saturday at the dome, all Semi Final games are suppost to be on Saturday. Why would MCC agree to have to leave school on Thursday and play Friday night?. #3, MCC did earn it. They had 30 POP that year than Norway did. Norway should have had to travel.. #4, know what the fu&* you are talking about when before you get on here spewing facts (or lack of). Look it up genious, 2006, the weekend before Thanksgiving, who played at what times for a Semi Final.
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applefan84		#11	[url]	[-]
Junior Posts: 122 11/11/08 3:59 PM	Doc38 wrote: #1, it wasn't a regional final, it was a semi final game. #2, the reason MCC was forced to play Friday night was because there was 2 other Semi Final games that Saturday at the dome, all Semi Final games are suppost to be on Saturday. Why would MCC agree to have to leave school on Thursday and play Friday night?. #3, MCC did earn it. They had 30 POP that year than Norway did. Norway should have had to travel.. #4, know what the fu&* you are talking about when before you get on here spewing facts (or lack of). Look it up genious, 2006, the weekend before Thanksgiving, who played at what times for a Semi Final. upfootball made a typo but was essentially right. In the State Semifinals, the Region 1 and 3 Champions wear the home jerseys, and Regions 2 and 4 wear the away jerseys. (In the State Finals, the winner of the Regions 1/2 Semifinal wears the home jerseys, and the winner of the Regions 3/4 Semifinal wears the away jerseys.) In the State Semifinals, POP is absolutely irrelevant. The team with more POP may well have to travel further. It is completely conditioned on site availability. The MHSAA cannot control which schools and institutions choose to make their facilities available, and when, that late after the end of the high school regular season. So, with respect to the year that MCC and Norway played in the State Semifinals, it all went exactly as it should, especially given the MHSAA's de facto rule that State Semifinal games involving western UP teams are played at the Superior Dome. (This rule is more than equitable. Not only is the Superior Dome an excellent venue, but UP teams are hit much harder by travel in almost all sports; making the LP "pay" a little by sending them on longer trips to play at a superlative venue is entirely fair.) When MCC played at the Superior Dome in 2006, there were 3 games scheduled for the Superior Dome, which meant someone was going to need to play on Friday night. Whoever that was, wasn't going to be happy, but such is life. Someone had to be unhappy and it was MCC, or at least some MCC fans. All games usually are on Saturday, but site availability and weather considerations sometimes demand alternative approaches. It is always at the discretion of the MHSAA staff that are arranging the Semifinal locations to be as flexible as necessary. Doc38, I'd just ask that you refrain from spewing invective and lecturing people about the necessity to know what they're talking about when your angry and uninformed comments indicate that you don't, either. We have a friendly community here, and if you're going to be high-and-mighty about something, at least have the decency to be correct.
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applefan84		#12	[url]	[-]
Junior Posts: 123 11/11/08 4:04 PM	Mr NCAA wrote: TCSF is suppose to be the home team and has to play in the YooperDome so that's an even bigger disadvantage for you Searn. I thought that perhaps 3 or 4 of these 5 games would end up in the YooperDome. I was really hoping for 4 to reduce costs some more and to provide a good weather facility. I guess that the MSHAA didn't want the players getting home that late, but the D8 could have been the last game of the evening since St. Ignace isn't that far away. With only 3 games in the YooperDome, the CMU should have been the next choice to play 2 games instead of Cheboygan and Gaylord. This is the one that really astonished me. In the State Semifinals, I am absolutely willing to accept even very large travel disparities. It's so late into November and the weather gets so bad and the teams can be in such strange places in relation to each other. On the other hand, in the Regional Finals the default rule is for one of the teams to enjoy a home-field advantage. This is only upset when the road team would have to travel 200 or more miles. Although it is not said in express terms, it seems to me that, since we are depriving one of the teams from the opportunity to have a home game through no fault of their own but only because they had the bad luck of ending up facing a team that's especially far away, some effort at finding a "true" neutral or halfway site is implied when the 200-mile rule is invoked.
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applefan84		#13	[url]	[-]
Junior Posts: 124 11/11/08 4:09 PM	HSSportsGuru wrote: This nothing new for U.P. teams. Last year, Menominee had to travel to Gaylord to play Standish-Sterling. Menominee was the home team, but had to travel almost twice as far to play that game. Lots of lower Peninsula teams squak when they get shipped to the Superior Dome this time of year. I somewhat understand if the L.P. team is unbeaten and/or has the better POP average. But I cannot understand ANY coach this time of year choosing to want to play outside, when they are given an option to play indoors at the Superior Dome. It seems that all the remarks I've read after an L.P. team plays a game at the S.Dome is that they LOVED playing there, regardless of whether they won their game or not. How can driving a few extra miles be such a big thing? I would think coaches from all over would love to play indoors if possible. I guess the only ones that don't want to play at a dome are those coaches who don't have any confidence in their own teams abilities against an upcoming opponent. IF that is their reasoning, then perhaps those coaches should get out of coaching then. I tend to agree with all of this . . . for the State Semifinals. In the Regional Finals, where the assigned location only comes into play when the teams are a sufficient distance from each other, like I said in another post, that seems to imply a good-faith effort on the part of the MHSAA to select a "true" neutral location. I mean, in D4, GRCC is playing Kingsford at the Superior Dome. It seems to me, if the MHSAA can't come up with a more neutral assigned location than that, why are they depriving Kingsford of a home game? When GRCC is traveling 400 miles, what's 20 or 30 more to get to Kingsford?
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Mr NCAA		#14	[url]	[-]
All-Searn Hall of Fame Posts: 6188 11/11/08 4:47 PM MHSAA Football Stats	Unless the MHSAA or a school district such as Cheboygan, Gaylord, Grayling, or Petoskey is willing to cough up the money for field turf or another suitable surface, then the YooperDome or CMU is the next best thing. The MHSAA has waived the 200 mile rule for the 2 district games. St. Iggy vs. CFFP wasn't that far over the 200 mile limit. I would have allowed a waiver for that game provided that the other 4 games were played at the Yooperdome on the same day. I just assumed that all 3 Yooperdome games were on Saturday, but they aren't. So no excuse for not having 4 games there with another one at Gaylord. People will complain that Hudsonville, Lowell, and Muskegon were all placed in one region as well based on geography. So the playoff system is what it is. What we need is to seed the teams regionally instead of by district and to reseed after every round. Teams don't exchange games films until that week anyways so it makes sense to reseed after every week.
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Doc38		#15	[url]	[-]
Sophomore Posts: 51 11/11/08 5:10 PM	applefan84 wrote: Doc38 wrote: #1, it wasn't a regional final, it was a semi final game. #2, the reason MCC was forced to play Friday night was because there was 2 other Semi Final games that Saturday at the dome, all Semi Final games are suppost to be on Saturday. Why would MCC agree to have to leave school on Thursday and play Friday night?. #3, MCC did earn it. They had 30 POP that year than Norway did. Norway should have had to travel.. #4, know what the fu&* you are talking about when before you get on here spewing facts (or lack of). Look it up genious, 2006, the weekend before Thanksgiving, who played at what times for a Semi Final. upfootball made a typo but was essentially right. In the State Semifinals, the Region 1 and 3 Champions wear the home jerseys, and Regions 2 and 4 wear the away jerseys. (In the State Finals, the winner of the Regions 1/2 Semifinal wears the home jerseys, and the winner of the Regions 3/4 Semifinal wears the away jerseys.) In the State Semifinals, POP is absolutely irrelevant. The team with more POP may well have to travel further. It is completely conditioned on site availability. The MHSAA cannot control which schools and institutions choose to make their facilities available, and when, that late after the end of the high school regular season. So, with respect to the year that MCC and Norway played in the State Semifinals, it all went exactly as it should, especially given the MHSAA's de facto rule that State Semifinal games involving western UP teams are played at the Superior Dome. (This rule is more than equitable. Not only is the Superior Dome an excellent venue, but UP teams are hit much harder by travel in almost all sports; making the LP "pay" a little by sending them on longer trips to play at a superlative venue is entirely fair.) When MCC played at the Superior Dome in 2006, there were 3 games scheduled for the Superior Dome, which meant someone was going to need to play on Friday night. Whoever that was, wasn't going to be happy, but such is life. Someone had to be unhappy and it was MCC, or at least some MCC fans. All games usually are on Saturday, but site availability and weather considerations sometimes demand alternative approaches. It is always at the discretion of the MHSAA staff that are arranging the Semifinal locations to be as flexible as necessary. Doc38, I'd just ask that you refrain from spewing invective and lecturing people about the necessity to know what they're talking about when your angry and uninformed comments indicate that you don't, either. We have a friendly community here, and if you're going to be high-and-mighty about something, at least have the decency to be correct.
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Mr NCAA		#16	[url]	[-]
All-Searn Hall of Fame Posts: 6189 11/11/08 5:29 PM MHSAA Football Stats	If you are talking about 2006, here is the final CPA based on what Andy emailed me with: 495. 335 Norway (7-2) 62.889 496. 334 Springport (6-3) 47.333 497. 333 Lincoln Alcona (2-7) 15.333 498. 333 McBain (2-7) 20.556 499. 332 Burton Bentley (6-3) 48.000 500. 331 Hesperia (0-9) 3.000 501. 326 Concord (0-9) 3.444 502. 325 Centreville (7-2) 60.556 503. 322 Blanchard Montabella (3-6) 20.639 504. 322 Holton (6-3) 46.556 505. 320 Allen Park Cabrini (6-3) 44.444 506. 319 Homer (6-3) 46.111 507. 317 Royal Oak Shrine Catholic (7-2) 61.889 508. 317 Rudyard (3-6) 22.222 509. 312 Traverse City St Francis (8-1) 79.079 510. 311 Pellston (1-8) 9.111 511. 311 Rochester Hills Lutheran Northwest (4-5) 32.000 512. 308 Detroit Loyola (5-4) 42.056 513. 305 Britton-Macon (4-5) 33.556 514. 303 White Pigeon (3-6) 26.222 515. 301 Manton (4-5) 33.111 516. 300 Coleman (0-9) 3.444 517. 300 Genesee (6-3) 46.556 518. 300 Mesick (4-5) 32.333 519. 300 Morenci (4-5) 29.333 520. 299 Ubly (7-2) 54.889 521. 294 St Ignace (4-5) 29.778 522. 292 Dansville (5-4) 37.444 523. 290 Athens (2-7) 17.333 524. 290 Decatur (8-1) 62.889 525. 289 Brethren (3-6) 22.111 526. 286 Potterville (1-8) 9.444 527. 286 Reading (7-2) 54.444 528. 286 Stephenson (5-4) 40.333 529. 276 Pewamo-Westphalia (6-3) 45.667 530. 274 Dryden (2-7) 13.250 531. 274 Merrill (6-3) 51.667 532. 271 Bellevue (1-8) 9.889 533. 271 Dearborn Hts Star International (0-9) 2.972 534. 270 Hale (1-8) 8.014 535. 268 Fife Lake Forest Area (2-7) 16.111 536. 266 Petersburg-Summerfield (2-7) 19.000 537. 266 Rogers City (7-2) 54.556 538. 264 Fulton-Middleton (9-0) 76.778 539. 264 Mio (7-2) 49.111 540. 262 Muskegon Catholic Central (7-2) 74.778 I see a difference of 12-, not even close to your 30 mark.
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trezdustrial		#17	[url]	[-]
All-Searn 2nd Team Posts: 1259 11/11/08 7:30 PM West Coast Mod	I think it is possible the MHSAA views playing in the Dome a "reward" of some sort. A good experience for the kids and fan's. I also feel it is an equalizer for the UP schools like Kingsford who have to travel so far in the first couple rounds. This is still a home game for Kingsford, in fact more fans will likely show up (can you say fair weather?) Plus they'll have more support from neighboring communities.
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upfootball		#18	[url]	[-]
Senior Posts: 295 11/11/08 7:40 PM http://up-football.com	Doc38 wrote: #1, it wasn't a regional final, it was a semi final game. #2, the reason MCC was forced to play Friday night was because there was 2 other Semi Final games that Saturday at the dome, all Semi Final games are suppost to be on Saturday. Why would MCC agree to have to leave school on Thursday and play Friday night?. #3, MCC did earn it. They had 30 POP that year than Norway did. Norway should have had to travel.. #4, know what the fu&* you are talking about when before you get on here spewing facts (or lack of). Look it up genious, 2006, the weekend before Thanksgiving, who played at what times for a Semi Final. Doc before you chew somebody out and tell them to know what the hell they are talking about make sure that person is actually wrong. I simply said Regional instead of Semifinal. If you would have been paying attention to the content you would have realized what I meant. The point was pretty clear. Everything else I said was also correct. MCC wanted to play on Friday night rather then Saturday morning at 11 when they were originally scheduled to play. Those are the facts. The Superior Dome regularly plays triple headers in the playoffs. They flew up to Marquette. They did not leave on Thursday night. They left on Friday. At no time have I or anyone else in this thread ever disputed MCC had more playoff points. Before taking out road rage on somebody else please re-read after counting to 10. Sheesh... When it comes to football with UP teams involved... believe me I am pretty knowledgable and usually dead on. Last Edited By: upfootball 11/11/08 8:14 PM. Edited 4 times.
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Searn		#19	[url]	[-]
All-Searn Hall of Fame Posts: 6177 11/11/08 7:58 PM Board Owner http://michiganhsfootball.com http://ndfanzone.com	I'll first say ... I've never been to Northern Michigan or the UP in late November for a football game ... so I won't comment on those conditions... But I'd rather see all games played outdoors ... I'd love to see the MHSAA finals in a smaller/outdoor stadium such as a CMU type stadium. "Crank Me Up!" Check out the New Forums Michigan High School Hockey Michigan High School Wrestling
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WMCfootball		#20	[url]	[-]
Junior Posts: 57 11/11/08 10:01 PM	upfootball wrote: TCSF always CHOOSES to play in the Dome. They like it. They think it helps them if they get to Ford Field. Gotta love that attitude. I have no idea why Iron Mountain was forced to go all the way down to Gaylord. If this was Montague's decision this was a HUGE mistake. The weather they played in Clare is nothing. A little rain slows down your offense that much? Please.... Gaylord is in a lake effect snow/rain belt. Iron Mountain is now an overwhelming favorite in my opinion. If Montague goes to the full house T they will struggle to move the chains. IM sees that offense all the time. It isn't as difficult to stop as the Spread of turf! Still irritates me that the UP folks cannot see a triple header in the Dome on Saturday. Iron Mountain didn't get the shaft, us fans did. BTW - Iron Mountain would win in the Dome as well. Montague has speed. Ok so does Iron Mountain. I don't want to hear any Montague excuses after this loss. The best team will win. Sounds like you're pretty upset? Montague made the trip up there last year. I thought for sure they would be playing up there again this year but I guess I was wrong about that. It seems like they would want to play indoors this time of year but maybe they didn't want to make the trip this year. I don't really know how the game ended up in Gaylord. Also, don't even start about the "excuses" stuff. Did you hear the IM fans last year after they lost? Give me a break.
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Iron Mountain gets the shaft ...

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